Former Olympian debates trans politics on Dr. Phil: “No training can ‘outrun biology'”

On a Friday edition of Dr. Phil, a former Olympic swimmer and a trans activist argued over whether trans women should be permitted to play women’s sports.

Former Olympian and attorney Nancy Hogshead-Makar said that “there’s no training, no coach, that’s gonna outrun biology.”

She also added, “throughout all levels of sports, trans women are taking spots away from females, and it’s just not fair.”

On the show, she said that a biological guy who has gone through puberty had advantages over biological women that go beyond height and muscle density.

Hogshead-Makar said,

“It’s not just height and lung capacity and bigger heart its also like a bigger throat, I mean that was the first time ever that I felt jealous of men.”

She also noted that when swimming, one has to take fast breaths while above water to absorb more oxygen. She stated,

“To have a 40 percent bigger throat to me-it would have been amazing.” Hogshead-Makar also spoke with Dr. Phil about competing against East German ladies who were famed for abusing performance-enhancing medications to the point that they had to shave.

Transgender activist Layne Ingram disagreed with Hogshead-Makar’s assertion that males always outperform women.

She said, “We can’t come out and over-generalize and say ‘T affects everything’ and scientifically there is no evidence that says that, because of testosterone level, that trans women have an inherent competitive advantage.”

Hogshead-Makar maintained her position. She said: “I do think that having gone through male puberty gives somebody an advantage that you just can’t train for, get coached for, eat for, sleep-right? There’s nothing that somebody can do that can make up for Leah Thomas’ six-foot-four, bigger hands, longer limbs, bone density, that bigger throat.”

Riley Gains, a female swimmer who notably tied with transgender competitor Lia Thomas for fifth place in an NCAA swimming tournament, was also interviewed by Dr. Phil.

She said to Dr. Phil that she felt the situation was unfair, adding: “we had someone who spent three years on the men’s side at UPenn, all of a sudden senior year flipped to the women’s side.”

Gains said, “Thomas was in the 400’s and 500’s ranked nationally, and one year later ranks number one, and so I think that right there shows you that there are advantages to be had and denying so it kind of defies science, it defies common sense, it defies logic, it defies reason,”