Former Trump administration adviser Calley Means has revealed how Joe Rogan personally intervened with President Donald Trump to push forward psychedelic research, breaking through what he described as significant resistance within the White House.
Speaking on The Joe Rogan Experience #2578, Means who helped implement the Make America Healthy Again (MAHA) agenda, detailed how the initiative faced bureaucratic roadblocks despite being a campaign promise, with senior officials allegedly attempting to slow down the process.
According to Means, psychedelic research was effectively being blocked by senior White House officials who wanted to delay the initiative.
“The psychedelic thing was being totally blocked, full directive from the top that we were going to slow that down and not do it,” Means stated.
He specifically pointed to resistance from Chief of Staff Susie Wiles and FDA commissioner nominee Heidi Overton, claiming they viewed psychedelics through the same lens as recreational [ ] rather than potential treatments for mental health conditions.
“She talked about these in the same class as street [ ]. I’m like, people aren’t doing recreational Ibogaine. That’s not how it works,” Means explained.
Means characterized the opposition as largely institutional rather than driven by an informed assessment of psychedelic-assisted therapy.
“It was just institutional resistance to doing anything new,” he said. “The top people at the White House didn’t have a full understanding of what they were or no interest.”
With the initiative seemingly stuck, Rogan reportedly contacted Trump directly, prompting the president to intervene and demand immediate action.
“Your call to President Trump, and President Trump, whenever there was an issue which was on his radar, he’s like, ‘Let’s get it done. Let’s go hard,'” Means recalled.
“He said, ‘We need to get this done. Get this on my desk in the next week.’ And it busted through the system.”
However, the intervention reportedly did not go down well with everyone inside the White House, with some officials accusing Rogan of bypassing the established policy process.
“People were very upset about that call,” Means said. “At one point, a person said to me, ‘This is an end run. This is an end run of the policy process.'”
Means pushed back against the criticism, arguing that Rogan’s influence and connection with the public made his involvement entirely legitimate.
“I said back that you calling the president is not an end run. You represent a lot of people. You have your finger on the pulse. You help the president. You have every prerogative to call the president.”
Rogan has repeatedly advocated for psychedelic-assisted therapy, particularly in addressing mental health issues. During the conversation, the podcast host reiterated his belief that these treatments could have a transformative impact on society.
“I think it’s going to change mankind. I really genuinely believe this. I know people think I’m naive or that I have some very idealistic and utopian view of what this stuff can accomplish, but we have a gigantic problem with people who have [ ] in this country. And it’s one of the most effective things that’s ever been studied by far.”
Means similarly expressed confidence that the administration could eventually move the initiative forward, despite the setbacks.
“I promise you that there’s people in there and me still, we’re going to do whatever possible to make sure that gets out, which means that there’s a path to have some of the [ ] reviewed, that there’s fast-tracked on the research, that this stuff gets out of the box,” he said.
“It has to happen. It’s going to be one of the greatest accomplishments of the Trump administration.”
Despite Trump’s intervention, Means acknowledged that getting the initiative across the finish line remains a challenge, alleging that parts of the administration’s bureaucracy continue to obstruct policy changes.
“You have an infrastructure that is trying to wait us out and bog down everything,” he said.
Nevertheless, Means maintained that psychedelic research remains one of the initiatives he is most optimistic about, pointing to ongoing communication with officials working to keep the process moving.
“Out of all the issues, I am optimistic. We’ve got people that are good people that are still in there I’m communicating regularly with that are flagging issues and making sure this goes through.”
